Where do / would you go for servicing?

[Nosevi]

Hi all.

I've been trying to work out on this newer forum software how to do a poll but have come up short so if possible could anyone who reads this post a very brief reply. I just want to know general feelings about where people get their Ferrari serviced and if possible why.

I've owned my car for around 15 years now and I have to admit I've not always been overwhelmed by the level of service I've had when she's had to go in for servicing. I've had everything from oil being massively overfilled (at a main dealer) which almost resulted in it overflowing the first time I got the car up to temperature (clearly showing they hadn't) to leather seats being severely dented. I've had overspray on the front of the car when it wasn't even being painted to seat bolts being cross threaded and so not in fully (trimmer called me in to see before he touched them). That's just a taste but there have been plenty of other instances.

A new multi-marque specialist (Ferrari, Aston, Bentley, Porsche) has just opened close to me in deepest darkest Lincolnshire and while I've always gone to just Ferrari only specialists or main dealers I'm thinking of giving them a go. The owner actually owns a couple of Ferraris amongst other cars and opened the specialist for exactly the reasons I mentioned above - he's been less than impressed with the service he's got elsewhere. I spoke to the master mechanic who was working on a 599 when I visited and he seems to know his stuff........... better than the main dealer service guy who I spoke to a couple of weeks ago who asked if I wanted them to change the power steering fluid on my 348 at the service ?!?!?

So anyway, where do or would you use and why? I guess the options are:

Main Dealer
Ferrari only indie
Multi Marque indie specializing in Ferrari
Any high performance car place
Any local garage
DIY

Appreciate any and all views. Cheers.

 

[A348W]

My personal experience is its down to the individuals, regardless indie or main dealer or other.

Ive had some right rubbish from a very well known indie, incompetent would be kind, and heard horror stories from main dealers and other indies alike.

Mine goes to Carrs in Exeter; (main dealer) convenient (ish) and sensible price with a track record in older cars. I use to take it to Dick Lovett, even more convenient, but there pricing went mental a few years ago.

Ive used Migliore and would happily do so again but just too far out of the way for me.

I have no hesitation in using an indie, but there are none that are convenient for me (well there is one but I saw a horror story from them, so wont go near them as a result.)

For me this is caveated that it goes in for annual services; most everything else I do myself. The market here is too fickle not to have a stamped service history, not that Im selling, but in case I do; and it is good to get a professional eye over it every year.

 

[Nosevi]

My personal experience is its down to the individuals, regardless indie or main dealer or other.

Ive had some right rubbish from a very well known indie, incompetent would be kind, and heard horror stories from main dealers and other indies alike.

Mine goes to Carrs in Exeter; (main dealer) convenient (ish) and sensible price with a track record in older cars. I use to take it to Dick Lovett, even more convenient, but there pricing went mental a few years ago.

Ive used Migliore and would happily do so again but just too far out of the way for me.

I have no hesitation in using an indie, but there are none that are convenient for me (well there is one but I saw a horror story from them, so wont go near them as a result.)

For me this is caveated that it goes in for annual services; most everything else I do myself. The market here is too fickle not to have a stamped service history, not that Im selling, but in case I do; and it is good to get a professional eye over it every year.

I do bits and bobs myself but not really anything major.

How would you personally feel about a multi marque specialist - Ferrari and a couple of other marques?

I've personally never used them but with having one open just down the road and having been less than impressed with some Ferrari specific places which are far less convenient (last place my car went to was a 4 hour round trip) I'm tempted to give it a go.

 

[A348W]

As long as you are confident they are not going to be learning on your car; why not.

Ask them how you to check the oil…!

 

[Nosevi]

As long as you are confident they are not going to be learning on your car; why not.

Ask them how you to check the oil…!

Yep, already did that.

 

[mon the fish]

When I bought my car I asked as many owners as I could where to take my car - in NE Scotland we're a 6-hour round trip from the indies and the main dealer, so time isn't the main factor. Everyone told me to avoid the main dealer, and the stories I've heard in the meantime certainly don't make me want to go there. I'm happy with my indie, he's not the cheapest but does a really thorough job (suspension stripped and waxoyled etc).

But we've had a local multi-marque indie start up only an hour away in the last couple of years - a sales place now branching out into servicing. They're initially specialising in Porsche to an extent, and have taken on a couple of Porsche techs from the main dealer. I tried them with a clutch change on my 550 last year, and was happy with the price and service. I'll still use my indie this year for the belts service, but once the local guys get a bit more experience and grow their reputation I may use them for servicing in the future.

The 550 isn't a modern, complicated car so I've got less worries about a general place doing work on it, it's more the wider reputation of them for any future resale that is the only concern I have.

 

[Nosevi]

But we've had a local multi-marque indie start up only an hour away in the last couple of years - a sales place now branching out into servicing. They're initially specialising in Porsche to an extent, and have taken on a couple of Porsche techs from the main dealer. I tried them with a clutch change on my 550 last year, and was happy with the price and service. I'll still use my indie this year for the belts service, but once the local guys get a bit more experience and grow their reputation I may use them for servicing in the future.

The 550 isn't a modern, complicated car so I've got less worries about a general place doing work on it, it's more the wider reputation of them for any future resale that is the only concern I have.

That's very much how I feel, particularly with the 348 being so basic in engineering terms. The multi-marque place that's recently opened near me looks after a few Ferraris already, as I say the owner has two - a 599 and 458, but they've had others in including I believe an engine out belt change on a Testarossa recently. My thought is to use them for the annual this year and see how it goes.

I guess the subtext for this thread is captured in your last line - will using a multi marque place effect ability to sell eventually? If other current owners would use them I guess the answer is no.

 

[mon the fish]

That's very much how I feel, particularly with the 348 being so basic in engineering terms. The multi-marque place that's recently opened near me looks after a few Ferraris already, as I say the owner has two - a 599 and 458, but they've had others in including I believe an engine out belt change on a Testarossa recently. My thought is to use them for the annual this year and see how it goes.

I guess the subtext for this thread is captured in your last line - will using a multi marque place effect ability to sell eventually? If other current owners would use them I guess the answer is no.

That's my thought - I'm waiting for them to become 'established' as a super/sports car place to go before I switch. The only reason for me to switch is convenience, it's a pain to drive 3 hours to drop a car off, get a lift or train home, then go back again a week later.

Aberdeen has been crying out for a decent sportscar specialist for years, fingers crossed these guys become the place to go. Although they are 20 mins down a singletrack road in the middle of nowhere so not that convenient either!

 

[Silver360]

Has F cars around 30 yrs . Live near Hull .
Testarossa was serviced by John Pogson ( Italia Autosport ) near Huddersfield about 1 1/2 each way .
It so far back I can’t remember anything adverse seemed ok .
Next was a 360 , it had FFSH so I sent it to JCT 600 Leeds ….again I think 7 / 8 annuals + belts every 3 yrs …nothing adverse . Infact they did a “ classic pricing “ and were quite ok with watching stuff like cam seal weeps etc . It seemed to eat suspension components over the 9 yrs and 22K miles it put on it . Infact the suspension add ons eclipsed the so called easy belt through the hatch Labour saving jobbie .

I had a pause for a yr when retiring , but in 2018 bought @ auction a 208GT 4 ….it had been in the U.K. for 4 yrs previous and a selection of London based indies mostly Joe Mac ,all seemed ok .
Being retired I did all the maintenance just routine + new rack , alternator, and few other bits .
2021 it was 5 yrs since the last belts so I sent it John Pogson . The business has evolved and I don’t think JP actually spanner’s any more? His lads ran up 39.5 hrs and over a £1000 of parts , this included many gaskets , and the two gearbox oil seals . Bill was £6500 …I was a bit shocked to say the least .
When it was delivered immediately brake fluid leaked out of a rear caliper …..a bolt on the outer adjuster wasn’t nipped up . 2 hrs running later it threw its AC belt . I drove it back and they replaced the idler pulley on the AC belt .
Two young lads and JP charged me £370 for the Labour and part . I was a bit miffed so never went back .

Pity really .

Anyhow it discovered ENSO automotive near Weatherby ( Ex JCT 600 ) they do multi margue ….the JCT high end so Ferrari , Aston , Porsche . Also Lambo s as they are similar + MOT etc .

I acquired a 348 SP about 14 months ago from a London indy . It’s been fine I have done a bit like the 30 A fuse HVAC ,
Plugs , and fitted a radio .

As mentioned it’s got full history , so even though a lub change is easy I let ENSO do it circa £800 all in + that stamp / invoice . It’s hopefully appreciating greater than the running costs ?

When I got it I noticed a damp grill under the pumpkin , and occasionally a drip on the garage floor .
Took it to ENSO to suss the place out and ask advice . My first contact .
He diagnosed the weepy throw out bearing seal as it was brake fluid not gear oil .
£700 later he removed the pumpkin and replaced a few seals , the bearing itself was fine , just the o rings and few behind . , while in there “ did the triple seals as it would be stupid not to seeing’s as its apart and there’s no history of them replaced .

It was better but still weeped , this was March last yr . I did not want to hassle him so ran it 9ver the sumner inc a European trip to the Furka etc .

It went fir its first annual ( the stamp thingy ) in December. I got a call from Mike Durham ( ENSO ) ….this is the refreshing difference……..” iam not happy with the seal work I did back in March , I put my name to the work …so will open up the pumpkin and redo it all as it’s still a bit damp on the grill “ FOC .

It’s been bone dry since .

Now compare that to Pogsons ( Italia Autosport ) approach ?

Going Fwds I will do the cam belts on my 208 as it looks straight Fwds . I have had the compression off a few times and don’t know what all the anti compressor stuff is all about .

How ever with the 348 when it’s due I will let ENSO do it …..already had a conversation and he says he always removes the cam covers and sets the bucket shims …..does not do “ lock n swap “ ….sounded good to me ,
I don’t want cheap I want quality/ done right , BTW I am thinking 3 yrs interval @ Indy’s with the 348 and 5 yrs DIY with the 208 .

I can’t see myself doing engine drops with the 348 .
But as I said I am not phased by buying engine drops based on 360 suspension + F1 issues …..over ownership period .

@ OP where is this new Indy’s address Ps . As I am in Hull .

 

[Nosevi]

Hi Silver, many thanks for the comprehensive reply.

I actually had a similar experience with an indie - the owner had/has a very good reputation as a mechanic but he no longer actually does the work and I had issues there.

The new indie is called Typhoon Specialist Vehicles and is just north east of Grantham so almost 2 hours from Hull. Really convenient for me just south east of Lincoln though. As I say tempted to give them a go for the annual and see how it goes.

Typhoon Specialist Vehicles

typhoonspecialistvehicles.com

 

[Silver360]

Hi Silver, many thanks for the comprehensive reply.

I actually had a similar experience with an indie - the owner had/has a very good reputation as a mechanic but he no longer actually does the work and I had issues there.

The new indie is called Typhoon Specialist Vehicles and is just north east of Grantham so almost 2 hours from Hull. Really convenient for me just south east of Lincoln though. As I say tempted to give them a go for the annual and see how it goes

Typhoon Specialist Vehicles

typhoonspecialistvehicles.com

Looks pretty much similar to ENSO automotive.

Enso Automotive | Ferrari and sports car specialists

Enso provides complete care for your sports, performance or supercar from scheduled servicing to performance upgrades, paint correction and PPF protection.

ensoautomotive.com

Go on FB , it’s a better illustration of the kinda work they do . Inc the dreaded getrag 7 DLC box repairs ( found on F cars 2009- 2018 ) and the FF front drive shaft seal .

He’s very busy as Weatherby (1 hr from me ) is in the famous golden triangle in Yorkshire…..so plenty of potential customers .

Interestingly last time I was in picking mine up they had a 812 in and dropped the engine .
The story goes the franchised did a routine lub service , owner picked it up and after 40 miles it ran rough and conked out on the motorway. Was flat bedded back to the dealership who said it needed a new engine ( had 4 K miles ) and wasn’t covered under the power warranty bcz he fitted an after market exhaust. As we all know that’s common practice in Ferrari land …Tubis , etc . An exhaust the franchise fitted btw earlier in his ownership. It was new from them too . He wasn’t told of warranty void issues when they sold it to him . He was the 2 nd owner buying through the Ferrari used approved .

So the owner flat bedded it to Mike .
Long story short they overfilled it . He sees a lot of overfilling and the post sequel.
It eventually hydrolocked as excess oil enters the cylinders, he told me they extracted 2 L out of the plenum as the oil breathers etc get overwhelmed by the excess in the crank case .
Car was on a lift in the air . Under it the exhaust, the rear g box , the torque tube the engine with the induction apparatus off and the heads and the sump off all the pistons and crank layed out on the floor . Fortunately nothing was damaged per se , it just needed a good clean up and a helluva load of gaskets to rebuild it .812 s aren’t designed for engine drops so the Labour time was high looking at 60 hrs .

The owner halted work as ENSO gathered evidence and the owner was getting “ all legal “ ….the warranty exclusion and obviously the overfill .

He told me it’s the dry sump thingy Ferraris have it’s easy for inexperienced to overfill and they don’t test drive them long enough to get up to temps + pressure to properly check the final levels ….

When doing lub changes on all my cars I read the manual to get a figure but also measure what comes out .
Say book suggests 8 L and 6.6 L comes out . I don’t blindly add another 8 . I put back 6.6 and check it .
Wether electronic ( Porsche) or dip / dry sumo tank = Ferrari .

We run Porsches as daily’s and I took one still under warranty to the Hull OPC .
It was Christmas. They had cake and drinks etc a bit of a xmas do . Out of the back came ALL these young ones , I thought it was a kinda a work experience tour from a college/ 6 th form ? You know visits to suss out a job etc .
One old guy in his 50 s . They had cake and drink in a group . Turns out the dealer principal was thinking them for the yrs work ……they were the techs!

TBH I was a bit horrified by there age demographics. I would except an even mix , a few older experienced chaps . Nope !

I guess in franchised dealerships , corporate owned , multi site , multi marque , this is Listers they have a high turnover of techs training and basically pay them not a lot more than minimum wage .Or when the day release college bit ends and they “ qualify “ They either get dissatisfied or are poached away for better pay . This suits the group as they bring in replacements [ on lower money] thus keeps overall staff costs down in the workshops . Multiply that over 50 sites and 10 marques = better bottom line .

Problem is we the customer and our cars are the perpetual Guinea pigs …when you take your car in.

There in lies the problem with large franchised dealers = staff turnover …..they loose the good ( read experienced ) guys .

 

[Nosevi]

Looks pretty much similar to ENSO automotive.

Enso Automotive | Ferrari and sports car specialists

Enso provides complete care for your sports, performance or supercar from scheduled servicing to performance upgrades, paint correction and PPF protection.

ensoautomotive.com

Go on FB , it’s a better illustration of the kinda work they do . Inc the dreaded getrag 7 DLC box repairs ( found on F cars 2009- 2018 ) and the FF front drive shaft seal .

He’s very busy as Weatherby (1 hr from me ) is in the famous golden triangle in Yorkshire…..so plenty of potential customers .

Interestingly last time I was in picking mine up they had a 812 in and dropped the engine .
The story goes the franchised did a routine lub service , owner picked it up and after 40 miles it ran rough and conked out on the motorway. Was flat bedded back to the dealership who said it needed a new engine ( had 4 K miles ) and wasn’t covered under the power warranty bcz he fitted an after market exhaust. As we all know that’s common practice in Ferrari land …Tubis , etc . An exhaust the franchise fitted btw earlier in his ownership. It was new from them too . He wasn’t told of warranty void issues when they sold it to him . He was the 2 nd owner buying through the Ferrari used approved .

So the owner flat bedded it to Mike .
Long story short they overfilled it . He sees a lot of overfilling and the post sequel.
It eventually hydrolocked as excess oil enters the cylinders, he told me they extracted 2 L out of the plenum as the oil breathers etc get overwhelmed by the excess in the crank case .
Car was on a lift in the air . Under it the exhaust, the rear g box , the torque tube the engine with the induction apparatus off and the heads and the sump off all the pistons and crank layed out on the floor . Fortunately nothing was damaged per se , it just needed a good clean up and a helluva load of gaskets to rebuild it .812 s aren’t designed for engine drops so the Labour time was high looking at 60 hrs .

The owner halted work as ENSO gathered evidence and the owner was getting “ all legal “ ….the warranty exclusion and obviously the overfill .

He told me it’s the dry sump thingy Ferraris have it’s easy for inexperienced to overfill and they don’t test drive them long enough to get up to temps + pressure to properly check the final levels ….

When doing lub changes on all my cars I read the manual to get a figure but also measure what comes out .
Say book suggests 8 L and 6.6 L comes out . I don’t blindly add another 8 . I put back 6.6 and check it .
Wether electronic ( Porsche) or dip / dry sumo tank = Ferrari .

We run Porsches as daily’s and I took one still under warranty to the Hull OPC .
It was Christmas. They had cake and drinks etc a bit of a xmas do . Out of the back came ALL these young ones , I thought it was a kinda a work experience tour from a college/ 6 th form ? You know visits to suss out a job etc .
One old guy in his 50 s . They had cake and drink in a group . Turns out the dealer principal was thinking them for the yrs work ……they were the techs!

TBH I was a bit horrified by there age demographics. I would except an even mix , a few older experienced chaps . Nope !

I guess in franchised dealerships , corporate owned , multi site , multi marque , this is Listers they have a high turnover of techs training and basically pay them not a lot more than minimum wage .Or when the day release college bit ends and they “ qualify “ They either get dissatisfied or are poached away for better pay . This suits the group as they bring in replacements [ on lower money] thus keeps overall staff costs down in the workshops . Multiply that over 50 sites and 10 marques = better bottom line .

Problem is we the customer and our cars are the perpetual Guinea pigs …when you take your car in.

There in lies the problem with large franchised dealers = staff turnover …..they loose the good ( read experienced ) guys .

All very true.

Regarding the 812 being over filled that's exactly what happened to me at a main dealer. Luckily having had it slightly over filled previously I always check the level as it warms up. As it ran away over the 'Full' mark I quite before the oil could go up the breather system into the top of the engine but had I just gone out for a drive I could well have been in the same boat as that owner had I not done that.

ENSO does look quite similar in that it looks like a pretty small setup. But that's not necessarily a bad thing I don't think. At least you know exactly who's working on the car. At a main dealer it's fair to say I've had very good and bad......... the snag is you rarely know which you'll get.

 

[mon the fish]

Funnily enough I got a letter today from Graypaul offering me a preferential rate of £100ph to rejoin their 'family'. I don't know what their normal rate is, but Bentley next door are £200ph

 

[Nosevi]

Funnily enough I got a letter today from Graypaul offering me a preferential rate of £100ph to rejoin their 'family'. I don't know what their normal rate is, but Bentley next door are £200ph

I've been offered that previously but somehow it didn't appear to drop the bill as much as I expected.

 

[A348W]

Funnily enough I got a letter today from Graypaul offering me a preferential rate of £100ph to rejoin their 'family'. I don't know what their normal rate is, but Bentley next door are £200ph

they will make the difference back up in parts and “hours” worked

 

[mon the fish]

Considering they didn't put a fuel injector back in properly on a friend's F355, which popped out the first time he floored it spraying petrol all over the engine bay, my car won't go near them.

The car was only saved as he had an extinguisher with him, and was quick with it. Graypaul denied all knowledge (despite recently replacing them at a service), and his insurance wouldn't pay out for the limited damage - they would only pay out if the car had been destroyed

 

[Nosevi]

Considering they didn't put a fuel injector back in properly on a friend's F355, which popped out the first time he floored it spraying petrol all over the engine bay, my car won't go near them.

The car was only saved as he had an extinguisher with him, and was quick with it. Graypaul denied all knowledge (despite recently replacing them at a service), and his insurance wouldn't pay out for the limited damage - they would only pay out if the car had been destroyed

I've heard horror stories like this at main dealers. As I said earlier you never really know who you'll get at a main dealer. I've had bad and very good when I've been to one. For my first engine out belts change I went to a main dealer and the guy who worked on my car had actually won the international Ferrari mechanic of the year that year in a competition at the Factory in Italy. Unsurprisingly I had zero issues after he had worked on the car. Another time for a simple annual service I had a short list of issues, the oil being overfilled being potentially the worst. It seems to be a total lottery what level of service you get. But perhaps I've just been unlucky a couple of times.

 

[A348W]

Considering they didn't put a fuel injector back in properly on a friend's F355, which popped out the first time he floored it spraying petrol all over the engine bay, my car won't go near them.

The car was only saved as he had an extinguisher with him, and was quick with it. Graypaul denied all knowledge (despite recently replacing them at a service), and his insurance wouldn't pay out for the limited damage - they would only pay out if the car had been destroyed

there are also similar stories from indies!

need to find a place/ mechanic you trust