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Problem with various little jobs carried out at a specialists.....

DarkShines

DarkShines

New member
Hi all, a bit of advice please if I may?!

My car spent several weeks in a very well known specialists workshop & at the time I had no reason to think anything was out of the ordinary, but now I'm wondering......

Firstly, the car had a lot of work carried out on it mechanically, and that would all appear ok.... So no complaints under the bonnet as such.

But...... Bearing in mind it had a full service & Cambelts change, and they inspected the car to find other faults etc etc, I'm really shocked to learn that they missed the fact that all 4 wheels were really badly bent & all had at least one crack in, some even welded from previous bodges.

On paying to have the window mech's adjusted & repaired, they have now dropped again.

I asked them to sort the squeaky brakes, yet this is now a lot worse.

And more worryingly, the car went into another specialist yesterday to have some other needed work doing & when I mentioned that the previous guys flushed through the braking system with meths from a local hardware shop they nearly fell over with shock! Although I questioned it's use at the time, I would never have doubted it as I trusted them.

The car picked up an ABS fault whilst in their care & I'm now wondering if it's because of something that happened there....

As it was I paid over £600 more than expected, as when I got the bill it was closer to £7k than the previously agreed £6k. But, with them in possession of my car I had no choice to pay it.

What would you do? Simply write to them stating your concerns & asking for some money to be returned?

I've never had issues like it before where I've had problems since spending large amounts of money.

Apologies for being a bore
 
DarkShines said:
The car picked up an ABS fault whilst in their care & I'm now wondering if it's because of something that happened there....
Click to expand...

Dont know much about the rest, but I do remember once reading that if you rotate the wheels when the cars (not your car, my car) off the ground, but with the ignition on it can trigger a (false) ABS fault requiring a reset.
Sorry, cant remember what it said about doing a reset, I've just made sure not to rotate wheels since.

But, I wonder if its that?
 
Flushing brake system with meths. Thats a new one on me. I have an ABS light on after playing around with the wheels the other day. Nothing else done. Only noticed when driving home. May try a reset later if I have time.
 
Welcome to the world of Ferrari! LOL

First things first, I'd never heard of meths being used either but it looks legit so you live and learn! :) try putting "flush braking system with methylated spirits" in google and click on a couple of the links for proper companies as opposed to individuals in forums and it looks like its used particularly when swapping fluid types or dot specs.

ABS fault can be triggered by moving the wheels with ignition on - done it myself. Only know how to reset it on a 348 but if you look in the workshop manual it should say but if similar its along the lines of pulling ABS specific fuses etc

Other items...not so good so would query them and then you can make a decision on whether to use them again based on their response.

IMO learn how to fix your car yourself! LOL
 
irarref said:
Welcome to the world of Ferrari! LOL

First things first, I'd never heard of meths being used either but it looks legit so you live and learn! :) try putting "flush braking system with methylated spirits" in google and click on a couple of the links for proper companies as opposed to individuals in forums and it looks like its used particularly when swapping fluid types or dot specs.

ABS fault can be triggered by moving the wheels with ignition on - done it myself. Only know how to reset it on a 348 but if you look in the workshop manual it should say but if similar its along the lines of pulling ABS specific fuses etc

Other items...not so good so would query them and then you can make a decision on whether to use them again based on their response.

IMO learn how to fix your car yourself! LOL
Click to expand...



The problem with the ABS is not there is a fault light, but in a hard braking instance ie emergency stop, it locks the rears up causing huge flat spots rendering the tyres useless each time. Under normal braking it is absolutely fine.... Very odd
 
DarkShines said:
The problem with the ABS is not there is a fault light, but in a hard braking instance ie emergency stop, it locks the rears up causing huge flat spots rendering the tyres useless each time. Under normal braking it is absolutely fine.... Very odd
Click to expand...


Doesn't sound good, I'd be pulling the ABS fuse and then road testing it, if the rears are locking then the rear ABS is not working, need to know if the fronts are working or have some other problem
 
I originally drove it home with the fuse out, but it's now back in.
The car has now gone into another specialist who is trying to solve the issue.
 
I know its a horrible premise, but could you find some dampness or gravelyness to see if the ABS works on the front at all?

Am guessing with a big heavy engine, and the nose diving, above the front wheels it might be tricky to trigger it .... but I would have thought the the info "just works on the fronts" as compared to "doesnt work at all" could guide your (or someone elses) search for the solution...
 
I'm not sure how they will trigger it, but to be honest I've put the spare wheels & tyres on her & tested her using quite a lot of force & it only appears to be the rears, and generally just one at that!
 
Unfortunately you've not put yourself into a particularly strong position I'm afraid.

How long ago was the work with the first specialist? How long before you realised things were amiss and how long after that before you called them?

Also, how long was it until it then went to ANOther specialist.

How did you leave the initial quote? Was there any sort of arrangement that they could "spend" more than the quote they gave?

Irrespective of whether they had your car or not, that would have been where I would have started (went through similar with a "well respected" indie myself). If they're trying to bill you for work that was not agreed then they are on a sticky wicket from the off, and trying to retain your car won't help their cause.

The rest depends on the timeline, but taking it to another shop won't have helped you here IMO.

Did you have the car inspected before purchase? By the same place??

The first step will be to approach the original place, calmly and with points that you'd like them to answer/address. It'd be better (though more "difficult" in many ways) to do this in person. Beyond that you're going to be into either writing off the experience or perhaps going through small claims and maybe asking the second specialist for "evidence", but they may not be prepared to do this and it could all get messy.
 
The problem with the ABS was noted by the 1st specialist on their final invoice which was sent to me via post, so it can't be described as a new fault due to the trip to Italy.

The reason I wanted the car back from the 1st specialist is simply because on every occasion that I planned to collect the car, I was then at the last minute informed of other needed works, it seemed never ending.

The reason it has gone to another specialist is purely because I have now lost faith in the 1st.

I seemed to spend a lot of money on diagnosing manually whereas a simple trip to QV in Windsor @ a cost of £60 quickly diagnosed my lumpy running issue as an O2 sensor & number 4 injector, whereas it had taken the 1st specialist some 3-4 weeks to fathom it due to having no Ferrari computer.

I did try & make a point about the over run costs but when the boss stands there playing slightly dumb to it with his cigar on the go, it was getting less & less comfortable by the 2nd.

We originally capped all work to £4k, it then went up to £6k with other mechanical & preventative work (all agreed)...... But on collection it had gone up by £700 & the whole spreadsheet which was on a prehistoric computer "couldn't" be printed off......

I'm contemplating just writing a letter & asking for a nominal amount to be paid back to me, for eg the bonnet catch repair @ £100 (still just as bad, if not worse), the steering wheel airbag retrim £100 (promised new leather, but old & worn leather just re stretched, although it suits the car better I was sold a "new" item), the window mech's not lasting more than 5 minutes etc etc.....

We will see, thanks for the replies though.
 
As I said in my PM, it's not the first time this has happened and it certainly won't be the last. When I got over billed by about £1000 I flatly refused too pay for anything I hadn't asked them to do and in fairness to them they agreed and so I paid £500 extra instead. This was all for work they had 'estimated' rather than 'quoted' so I was a bit stuck with it. I've since learned that other owners have come across the same situation with bills being far higher than they were expecting.

I have a deal with my main dealer - all work is quoted, no estimates, and they know I'll only pay what we have agreed and we're talking to the penny. The service manager has to be a bit inventive sometimes and by that I mean things like discounting some items (a complete alignment and geo setup last time was particularly well priced :) ) in order to get it all within 'budget'.

As an aside, you said the 'specialist' didn't have a Ferrari diagnostic computer? Sort of thought all the 'Specialists' did?
 
I'm seriously contemplating having a chat with Dick Lovett's who arranged my factory tour & laying it on the line with them.....

If you want another older Ferrari to work on, be straight & fair. Also quote not estimate........ Very tempting.

Nope, no computers, part of my bill was "fix this, it didn't work, fix something else, didn't work....." And so on
 
I always do quotes. My new garage that's being built - gave the builders the spec, they came back with an estimate. I told them if they wanted the job they'd come to me with a quote. They did. Don't do estimates, total waste of time IMO.

Re the computer, just surprised as I thought all the Ferrari Indies had them. Pretty hard to fault find on the newer models without them......... but I guess you know that.
 
It sounds like you've been subjected to the less "customer oriented" side of Ferrari specialists. Not good, but tbh I suspect you won't get anywhere materially with it and are probably best chalking it up to experience. Plus, whenever you see anyone asking for input on the place you used, drop them a PM with your feedback :wink3:

(btw, if it wasn't DL, it might be worth rewording your post above as it sounded to me like it could be :)).

Bills can rack up quickly on these cars. IMO, unless you have unlimited funds never, ever give an open cheque book to any servicing agent. Always be very clear, in writing, what you expect to be done, what the costs are and what margin of flexibility they have. And do not be afraid to ask daft sounding questions about the work being suggested.

And then check everything on collection, preferably with the guy who did the work going through it with you and demonstrating why he believes it is now fixed. For any parts replaced, ask to see the old ones (note that you'll want this before the work commences).

If they're going to stand by their work, they won't mind doing this. If they get the hump, go elsewhere.

(All of this from experience btw - I've been stung before. It smarts badly!).
 
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