348 door rewiring

[Nosevi]

Hi all. Got my car back from her service and both windows (yes both) were intermittent, worked or didn’t depending on how far open the door was. Both had worked perfectly on departure. Looked inside the wiring bellows in the door shuts to see a few wires either loose or out of the connectors entirely. Windows both then stopped working. Putting it down to coincidence but it’s a heck of a coincidence both going at the same time.

Anyway, I’m frankly hopeless at electrics so a mate who’s a motorbike mechanic (amongst other things) has said he’ll rewire the sockets. I have a Workshop Manual (pdf) which I’m guessing is for a LHD car. Has anyone rewired the plugs themselves and did they use the manual to determine which wire goes where or is there a RHD crib sheet somewhere?

Many thanks.

 

[A348W]

Hey Pete,

That is odd.

There are some good threads on Fchat about this with lots of pics etc. I looked into it once as its a common problem and the windows were the usual slow! I dont think you need a manual, you just need to make a sketch of what colour wire goes to which pin in the socket.

Basically there are three approaches from memory:
1) get new wiring harnesses and fit them. But just checking farrariparts and superformance they are currently unavailable.
2) you can get new individual wire connectors (pins etc) and re do the sockets, problem with this is that there might not be enough wire to cut the old connectors off, and get back to clean wire, as the ends will be most likley corroded to a certain extent, and hence option 3
3) you can cut the exisitig sockets off, cut the wires back to clean wire, add on new wire to get back to the connectors and re do the connector.

Dont forget that if the door side is gone, then likley that the other end in the frame will have some issues as well, believe you can get to it from the wheel arch but cant recal.

Good luck and lets see a Jeff esk post thread with lots of pictures! :thumbsup:

 

[Nosevi]

Cheers Adrian. Few pics later (early tee to make ) but I think we'll just be looking at rewiring the socket, mine's not in too bad shape, albeit with a few loose or disconnected wires on each side.

I've looked at some threads of FChat and all I've seen refer to LHD cars, just wasn't sure if the wiring colours and pins used are the same with RHD. Also not sure if the manual is correct for RHD and whether later cars were wired differently with different pins used. Guess I'll find out.......

 

[Nosevi]

That is odd.

There are some good threads on Fchat about this with lots of pics etc. I looked into it once as its a common problem and the windows were the usual slow! I dont think you need a manual, you just need to make a sketch of what colour wire goes to which pin in the socket.

Basically there are three approaches from memory:
1) get new wiring harnesses and fit them. But just checking farrariparts and superformance they are currently unavailable.
2) you can get new individual wire connectors (pins etc) and re do the sockets, problem with this is that there might not be enough wire to cut the old connectors off, and get back to clean wire, as the ends will be most likley corroded to a certain extent, and hence option 3
3) you can cut the exisitig sockets off, cut the wires back to clean wire, add on new wire to get back to the connectors and re do the connector.

Dont forget that if the door side is gone, then likley that the other end in the frame will have some issues as well, believe you can get to it from the wheel arch but cant recal.

Good luck and lets see a Jeff esk post thread with lots of pictures! :thumbsup:

I think looking at the sockets I'll be looking at just option 2 as the inside of the socket really isn't that bad. I've seen threads on FChat showing this sort of situation:





But my sockets look nothing like that. I could harp on about dehumidified garages etc but I won't :grin:







So I've ordered a bunch of these, link found on Jeff's thread so cheers :thumbsup:






And one of these, again from Jeff's thread:







Sent my mate the Workshop manual which is obviously in black and white with decodes and he sent back this, remains to be seen if it tallies with a RHD UK car:







And I think we're probably good to go for after the weekend.

One question, is it worth stripping all the door cards etc off so you have a bit more freedom to pull and trace wires etc? I've done it before for another reason and it's not hard to do.

 

[A348W]

you honestly dont need a manual or wiring diagram. just draw a picture of your connector and the wire colours to each individual pin and put them back as you found them! what each wire does doesnt matter!

lhd/rhd, id guess the only difference is the window switches!

 

[Nosevi]

you honestly dont need a manual or wiring diagram. just draw a picture of your connector and the wire colours to each individual pin and put them back as you found them! what each wire does doesnt matter!

lhd/rhd, id guess the only difference is the window switches!

Snag is there are a few wires off each connector and it's not clear which go to which pin. There's also some pins that aren't used ie the pin is there but no wire. So on the passenger side I think we have 2 loose wires and 3 unwired pins. Drivers side I think similar, more empty pins than loose wires.

 

[PAUL V]

With my car i did away with the connector pins, removed the pins extended the wires, passed them though the plug and soldered them up inside the door.

If i recall it was best to remove the "strakes" off the door to gain access either way

 

[Qavion]

Snag is there are a few wires off each connector and it's not clear which go to which pin. There's also some pins that aren't used ie the pin is there but no wire. So on the passenger side I think we have 2 loose wires and 3 unwired pins. Drivers side I think similar, more empty pins than loose wires.

On RHD cars, I believe the harnesses are mirrored (left/right).

Also, the WSM wiring diagram has a few wires in the wrong holes (according to some owners).

e.g. on the driver's side, the white/red wire is reportedly not on pin 9, but on pin 15, the black wire is not on pin 4, but on pin 13.

Also, it was discovered recently that the internal wiring shown in the switches must be wrong (otherwise the windows wouldn't work).

I haven't figured out the actual switch internals, but the wiring to the switches (and the rest of the car) is here on one page instead of four:

https://www.dropbox.com/t/72jtKKiVVOv6ACcq

Link expires in 6 days.

Dropbox offers a preview page (you can zoom and scroll the image).

 

[Qavion]

(EDIT: In your photo of the plug, is that the driver's side? The colours match the left hand side on a LHD car. This should tell us if the harnesses are swapped or not.)

The pins however seem to be in different holes in some cases.

 

[Qavion]

Looks like your car has a large brown wire in slot 13 instead of a black one (earth)





There may be a few other changes, too. I see a small black wire between the violet/white and the blue wire.

 

[Qavion]

Here's a graphic of the driver's door plug (LHS) shown from the socket side (with two reported variations)



Here is yours (although I can't make out a few of the wires).



Maybe you could list your colours as per the numbering system (horizontal rows, right to left and down) to see which wires are different from the WSM?

 

[Nosevi]

With my car i did away with the connector pins, removed the pins extended the wires, passed them though the plug and soldered them up inside the door.

If i recall it was best to remove the "strakes" off the door to gain access either way

Cheers Paul. I've seen that done on other cars but think we'll go for a straight 're-pinning' this time. :thumbsup:

 

[Nosevi]

On RHD cars, I believe the harnesses are mirrored (left/right).

Also, the WSM wiring diagram has a few wires in the wrong holes (according to some owners).

e.g. on the driver's side, the white/red wire is reportedly not on pin 9, but on pin 15, the black wire is not on pin 4, but on pin 13.

Also, it was discovered recently that the internal wiring shown in the switches must be wrong (otherwise the windows wouldn't work).

I haven't figured out the actual switch internals, but the wiring to the switches (and the rest of the car) is here on one page instead of four:

https://www.dropbox.com/t/72jtKKiVVOv6ACcq

Link expires in 6 days.

Dropbox offers a preview page (you can zoom and scroll the image).

Cheers for that, only had the black and white WSM version on 4 pages :thumbsup:

 

[Nosevi]

Looks like your car has a large brown wire in slot 13 instead of a black one (earth)

There may be a few other changes, too. I see a small black wire between the violet/white and the blue wire.

That's the passenger side. Yep, some wires are definitely in the wrong place but as I don't really want to start redoing the pin connectors on the car (ie through the wheel arch) I'm guessing they'l have to stay in the wrong places.

 

[Nosevi]

Here's a graphic of the driver's door plug (LHS) shown from the socket side (with two reported variations)

View attachment 158142

Here is yours (although I can't make out a few of the wires).

View attachment 158143

Maybe you could list your colours as per the numbering system (horizontal rows, right to left and down) to see which wires are different from the WSM?

Having looked at the WSM I've got 3 connectors with wire snapped/missing and 3 snapped wires - orange, white and grey. The 3 snapped wires correspond to those empty pins in the WSM so I think we're good to go simply putting those wires in those pins.





Where mine varies from my WSM is that while the WSM has the window switch wired into 1, 14 & 21 (and has 13 and 15 empty), on my car wires corresponding to the window switch seem to be in pins 13, 14 and 15 (and 1 and 21 are empty). Other than that it seems to tally with my WSM for the passenger side.

I think the plan is as Adrian said to simply re-pin all the connections and put them back where they are, with those 3 snapped wires going to the corresponding currently empty pins with bits of wire sticking out. With a bit of luck that'll sort it.

Mate who has more nimble fingers than me is over on Monday so I'll let you know if everything works afterwards or if we're still fault finding.


Appreciate the help all, many thanks :thumbsup:

 

[irarref]

If he doesn't mind take some pics as it may prove useful to others

 

[Nosevi]

If he doesn't mind take some pics as it may prove useful to others

Will ask but I'm sure it'll be fine :thumbsup:

At some point my car has been re-pinned and it looks like they randomly moved a few. Added to that, and just to keep life interesting, they must have extended the wires to do it and if you look inside the bellows you can just make out at least one (the thick brown one) isn't brown on the other side of the join, I think it's black. Once all the pins are marked and we're happy where they all go back (and by that I mean my mate is happy) we can get the plug off and the bellows off and see if any others are amusingly changed in colour half way along the wire.

Don't you just love Italian cars :laugh:

 

[Qavion]

As you say, your passenger plug more resembles the passenger plug on the LHD car, so the wiring harnesses have probably been reversed.

Here's a comparison:



Only pin 1 (white wire) and that large brown wire on pin 13 seems to be different. I've reversed your photo of the plug with the wiring shown.... That way it shows the wire colours on the contact side of the plug.

I've made some slight amendments to the graphics in my wiring diagram:

https://www.dropbox.com/t/dwSVP2I4pxczzyGQ

And here's the diagram for the mirror wiring, just in case any of these wires have been damaged:

https://www.dropbox.com/t/a5YgMhQd3Z4OSkST

 

[Qavion]

SOrry, uploaded the wrong wiring diagram...

https://www.dropbox.com/t/xa47PbUaG1fy5MIW

 

[Nosevi]

As you say, your passenger plug more resembles the passenger plug on the LHD car, so the wiring harnesses have probably been reversed.

Here's a comparison:

Only pin 1 (white wire) and that large brown wire on pin 13 seems to be different. I've reversed your photo of the plug with the wiring shown.... That way it shows the wire colours on the contact side of the plug.

I've made some slight amendments to the graphics in my wiring diagram:

https://www.dropbox.com/t/dwSVP2I4pxczzyGQ

And here's the diagram for the mirror wiring, just in case any of these wires have been damaged:

https://www.dropbox.com/t/a5YgMhQd3Z4OSkST

Cheers Ian, really helpful and very much appreciated. :thumbsup:

Think it's a case of wait until Monday, get these sockets re-pinned with the help of Ian's diagrams and see what works after that. My guess is it's the sockets that are to blame but even if there is some other issue lurking I think the sockets definitely need redoing. The cars are just of that age I think and the sockets are clearly the weakest link in the circuit.