Having looked at their website that is a fantastic hotel for a silly low price :shocked:
Quoted rates are MUCH higher .... where did you book it from please ?
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Euro Road Trip
- Thread starter Fluffekins
- Start date
Having looked at their website that is a fantastic hotel for a silly low price :shocked:
Quoted rates are MUCH higher .... where did you book it from please ?
jonnyjonkers
Member
This is a very honest report, I'm loving it! Keep it coming.
Fluffekins
New member
The plan for yesterday was Furka pass then Grimsel then Susten finally Ober something or other and back to Flims.
Weather forecast was a little dodgy but still looked alright as we left the hotel and headed off with roofs down.
It started to rain lightly so we pulled over outside a race team workshop. This was to be the highlight of the day.
They were the Radical dealer in Switzerland but mainly ran Customer’s cars - amateur gentlemen racers, who mostly used Ligiers and Radicals but anything a client wanted. They invited us to have a look around and we had a nice chat with the mechanic.
It’s owned by the fella next door who owns a Subaru dealer and a senior guy from Zurich Ins Co.
They lose money on the basis that they can’t compete with the lower costs of similar teams in Germany, France and Holland, but it’s a hobby that the owners are happy to indulge.
Anyway from there we went to the Furka. The heavens opened and with rain bouncing off the road we set off. The cloud was so low and the fog descended as we hit the top that the journey was very slow, and no fun at all.
After all the talk of tyre age on the forum recently i was very conscious of the age of my front tyres, and the fact that I’d left replacing them until after the trip. This did not inspire confidence coming down the pass with 10m visibility and rivers running down the road.
By the time we’d crawled up and down the other two passes we’d decided to find somewhere for lunch.
We found the most unpleasant fly invested hell hole imaginable. ‘Looked okay from the outside’ or rather it looked dry.
Anyway while there we were turning to decide a route back either going over the passes again (cloud and fog even lower) or taking a massive detour via motorways. The decision was made for us - Susten pass was closed. We set off and did a 200km detour to get back.
A total wash out of a day, 100’s of km driven for no enjoyment whatsoever.
We started our journey home today a big 350 km drive to Verdun in France - we expected poor weather all the way but actually we missed most of it and actually the drive wasn’t that bad.
Last night tonight, it’s belting down in Verdun.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Weather forecast was a little dodgy but still looked alright as we left the hotel and headed off with roofs down.
It started to rain lightly so we pulled over outside a race team workshop. This was to be the highlight of the day.
They were the Radical dealer in Switzerland but mainly ran Customer’s cars - amateur gentlemen racers, who mostly used Ligiers and Radicals but anything a client wanted. They invited us to have a look around and we had a nice chat with the mechanic.
It’s owned by the fella next door who owns a Subaru dealer and a senior guy from Zurich Ins Co.
They lose money on the basis that they can’t compete with the lower costs of similar teams in Germany, France and Holland, but it’s a hobby that the owners are happy to indulge.
Anyway from there we went to the Furka. The heavens opened and with rain bouncing off the road we set off. The cloud was so low and the fog descended as we hit the top that the journey was very slow, and no fun at all.
After all the talk of tyre age on the forum recently i was very conscious of the age of my front tyres, and the fact that I’d left replacing them until after the trip. This did not inspire confidence coming down the pass with 10m visibility and rivers running down the road.
By the time we’d crawled up and down the other two passes we’d decided to find somewhere for lunch.
We found the most unpleasant fly invested hell hole imaginable. ‘Looked okay from the outside’ or rather it looked dry.
Anyway while there we were turning to decide a route back either going over the passes again (cloud and fog even lower) or taking a massive detour via motorways. The decision was made for us - Susten pass was closed. We set off and did a 200km detour to get back.
A total wash out of a day, 100’s of km driven for no enjoyment whatsoever.
We started our journey home today a big 350 km drive to Verdun in France - we expected poor weather all the way but actually we missed most of it and actually the drive wasn’t that bad.
Last night tonight, it’s belting down in Verdun.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Fluffekins
New member
Mike, I’ll come back to you re booking details when I’m home in front of a PC.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
sssdu01
Active member
Very honest road trip story . Would be interesting to see what you think about doing this trip in a Ferrari when you have been home for a few days and had time to think about it.
I have got to the stage in my own Ferrari owning experience to think I would enjoy the trip more in my Cooper S. I just find the Ferrari performance cant be used on the public highway, the speed differential to other vehicles, along with other road users driving around blissfully unaware of how fast a supercar might be going, makes it just dangerous to drive anywhere near the limit unless you are on very open roads with no junctions etc ........ or I might get caught by plod driving in a manner that would get me a jail sentence !!
I have got to the stage in my own Ferrari owning experience to think I would enjoy the trip more in my Cooper S. I just find the Ferrari performance cant be used on the public highway, the speed differential to other vehicles, along with other road users driving around blissfully unaware of how fast a supercar might be going, makes it just dangerous to drive anywhere near the limit unless you are on very open roads with no junctions etc ........ or I might get caught by plod driving in a manner that would get me a jail sentence !!
Modificato
New member
I think this I why official events will need to take over from self organised stuff. In Italy last month
I met the organiser of the best of Italy race where they have negotiated 40km of closed roads for their event. As you suggest you have to really pick your desitination but also timing so you are not bogged down by regular traffic. I like night runs for that reason around here.
I met the organiser of the best of Italy race where they have negotiated 40km of closed roads for their event. As you suggest you have to really pick your desitination but also timing so you are not bogged down by regular traffic. I like night runs for that reason around here.
Murph7355
New member
A Caterham is excellent fun on a road trip. But you have to consider it more like a slightly safer motorbike than a car.
Getting caught outside in strong sunshine is worse than rain (or snow) IME. But as long as you're prepared, and plan your routes appropriately, there are few ways to have more fun on 4 wheels.
That said, I've also done tours in the 355 and V8 Vantage I owned. Also great fun, but in different ways and you plan different routes for those cars really.
Stelvio is very overrated IMO. There are better passes (San Bernadino was a lot of fun the last time I did it), especially for a more modern Ferrari.
btw, a std Caterham tank is 8 gallons and depending on how it's being driven you should be good for at least 25mpg and more likely 30mpg when not balls out (on track, 6mpg is doing well
). So the range isn't that horrendous.Everyone should do a trip like this at least once. My other half noted she couldn't think of anything worse. We then did Portugal and bits of Spain in the V8V and she absolutely loved it. Booked a couple of hotels that I definitely wanted to show her, but the rest we made up as we went along. It's a great way to see a country, and if you have an interesting car it's fun too and you meet lots of very friendly people.
swnyradar
Member
Apart from the scenery, I can't see why roads like this are called great driving roads? What's fun about accelerating, then braking to a low speed, millions of times in a row? (Not that I've been)
Great driving roads should have lots of fast, open, sweeping bends and elevation changes. Come to Wales, I can show you lots of them :grin:
(Sorry for the hijack - great thread!)
Fluffekins
New member
Spot on, I've thoroughly enjoyed every time I've been in a Caterham. The rain is a problem when you have to put the roof up, can't see anything as it steams up like a sauna and the 3 inch windscreen wipers are less that useful. Lorries simply can't see you and the spray that enters the cabin is like being in a jet wash (when using a half hood).
Fluffekins
New member
I couldn't agree more. These roads might be great if they were closed to other traffic, but when you have sheer drops on one side, and stone walls on the other it, I too think there are better roads, particularly in the foothills and in the valleys.
Funnily enough I was talking about Wales to my friends yesterday, the last time I tried I was aiming for the "Evo triangle", but I'm not sure I found it and with a hangover 4 hours sleep and a car I'd picked up 3 hours earlier, plus traffic - it was a bit of a non event.
I will try again.
For completeness sake the final day yesterday travelling from Verdun in France (nice town and lovely hotel) back to Calais. Weather was overcast but dry and we thought we were pushed for time so headed up the motorway.
The drive was quite pleasurable, toll booths make excellent drag race opportunities and our cars although very different are pretty evenly matched in acceleration terms, at least up to about 80 mph.
Even without 'racing' it was good to be able to experience the Ferrari's acceleration and the great noise it makes. Childish, I know.
We got to Calais quickly - you also see some interesting cars there and we saw a group of Daimler Dart owners on their way back from a trip.
Once back in Blighty, you are instantly reminded how poor our roads are and how disinterested our authorities seem to be in repairing them and how good French roads are in comparison. Obviously some traffic on the M25 but other than that, all good.
I'll reflect on the trip over the next day or so and finally write up my thought and a summary.
Thanks all for reading my ramblings. Not sure why the pictures only appear as links, as they appear when using the app.
All the best,
sssdu01
Active member
Some of the roads in the welsh weekender were just epic, and its the only public highway where its been safe to use a bit more of the cars performance :grin:
Kyodo
Active member
Personally I've seen nothing in the UK that can rival the good European roads. I'm not talking about the famous passes as they can get snarled up with traffic , although not always. Tourists should be expected and when we take our cars, that's exactly what we are too! We found we could enjoy the passes at a reasonable speed without being silly.
Get off the beaten track and there are thousands of real treats :drive:
Get off the beaten track and there are thousands of real treats :drive:
Mike01606
Active member
You need to take up Mike’s offer Mark. These are off the off the beaten track :grin::thumbsup:
OP look forward to your final reflections
Last edited:
MalcH
Active member
Seconded. It's not like any other road trip/outing I've ever done.
Fluffekins
New member
Finally after a week of reflection (and being back at work) here are my final thoughts on the trip and some helpful hints and tips:-
Advice
1.DO NOT spend 2 days of solid hard graft "detailing" your car before the trip. It is a total waste of time will give you a sore back.
2.See no.1
3. Decide on the type of trip you are looking for is a) a sightseeing trip with a leisurely drive or b) a search for driving thrills or c) an adventure or something different, and plan route accordingly
4. Maps are your friends. Get a really good map or a decent app that lets you enter routes into a decent quality Sat Nav (this rules out anything Ferrari have supplied in any of their fabulous cars).
5. Spend some time plotting a route giving due regard to the time and day that you 'll be on the road and what this means in terms of other road users or even the availability of certain roads.
6. Don't try and do too much, pick a drive for the day and possibly have options to do more or do less depending on how you feel, the weather etc.
7. The internet is a great resource, but bare in mind that everyone else is looking at the same web sites. As someone said earlier in the thread - get off the beaten track.
8. Have realistic expectations.
9. Have decent communications if travelling with others - we had excellent 2 way radios
10. DO NOT and I cannot stress this enough, do not spend 2 days detailing your car!
Reflections
Clearly my advice is based on my experience and reflection of the trip, but the first thing I should make clear is that the trip itself was excellent, spending a week on the road with your friends in some beautiful places was a real pleasure and a privilege. Owning a Ferrari for me was lifelong ambition and there were times on the trip when I had to remind myself of that, but more often there were times that I had to pinch myself, I'm driving the Stelvio pass in a Ferrari - my Ferrari, and I'm with my close friends. Life is good.
My previous trips have been in a Caterham, a hired Caterham at that and there is definitely a difference between driving someone else's car where your maximum liability is the excess and potential injury and driving your own pride and joy which represents the rewards of many years of hard work, and a fair proportion of one's wealth.
That said I think it is more about expectations. We were looking for the ultimate in driving roads, just short of a racetrack on the road. We didn't really find this in the Black Forest so we could've skipped that completely and gone straight to Switzerland. That said it was 4 days of travelling for 3 days in the alps. That was too much, and although skipping the Black Forest would've given us more time in Switzerland it is still a lot of travelling.
Due to the weather on the final day in Switzerland as I've written previously, the final day on which we had massive expectations and should've been the best of all was completely spoiled and was actually the worst.
In summary, we spent too long travelling and not enough time driving and some of the roads were busier than expected.
The Car
The question I had before the trip was, would I miss the Caterham. There is seriously something very cool and special about 3 Caterham's rolling into town. The positive reaction you get is fantastic.
I did miss this aspect a little although I have to say that the reaction of the Ferrari was almost exclusively positive. Particularly in France actually, guys on the motorway with thumbs up and urging me to overtake. There was a teenager on a bike in Verdun, riding alongside with his phone taking pictures. He followed us to the hotel and I invited him to sit in the car and I took some pictures of him in it.
The preparation rituals you have to do every morning to get a Caterham ready and every night when you finish up was something I too thought I'd miss, but in practice I was glad I didn't have to faff about like the other two, although I did spend lots of time wishing they'd bloody hurry up!
There were definitely times where the Ferrari felt a little too big, Stelvio was one, due to the cycle race and general traffic and getting in to the odd underground car park, and in this respect being in a Caterham would've been better and more fun.
However, there was a particular drive to the hotel in Vals that I'll never forget and wouldn't want to have been in any other car. Also the vast distances on French motorways were a relative joy in the Ferrari, especially the tolls an especially when the weather turned bad.
What is true though is that our experiences are somewhat different because of the different cars and what they represent to each of us as I mentioned at the start.
As we start to think about next years trip I am slightly concerned that the driving I'm looking for may be slightly different to what my friend's are looking for in their Caterham's. In Caterham speak a "blatt" down some country roads whereas I think i need something a little wider with sweeping bends rather than hairpins.
I also think though that given that we own these cars and drive them all year (rather than just a week in a Caterham every year) that we might have got the "looking for a public racetrack" thing out of our system by the time we go away next year and instead do not judge the trip on the quality of the driving rather than the quality of the journey, destination and adventure.
Finally, if you haven't done something like this in your Ferrari, you really should, it's what they're made for - oh and that sound!
If you got to the bottom of this, thank you for taking the time to read and the comments along the way.
Advice
1.DO NOT spend 2 days of solid hard graft "detailing" your car before the trip. It is a total waste of time will give you a sore back.
2.See no.1
3. Decide on the type of trip you are looking for is a) a sightseeing trip with a leisurely drive or b) a search for driving thrills or c) an adventure or something different, and plan route accordingly
4. Maps are your friends. Get a really good map or a decent app that lets you enter routes into a decent quality Sat Nav (this rules out anything Ferrari have supplied in any of their fabulous cars).
5. Spend some time plotting a route giving due regard to the time and day that you 'll be on the road and what this means in terms of other road users or even the availability of certain roads.
6. Don't try and do too much, pick a drive for the day and possibly have options to do more or do less depending on how you feel, the weather etc.
7. The internet is a great resource, but bare in mind that everyone else is looking at the same web sites. As someone said earlier in the thread - get off the beaten track.
8. Have realistic expectations.
9. Have decent communications if travelling with others - we had excellent 2 way radios
10. DO NOT and I cannot stress this enough, do not spend 2 days detailing your car!
Reflections
Clearly my advice is based on my experience and reflection of the trip, but the first thing I should make clear is that the trip itself was excellent, spending a week on the road with your friends in some beautiful places was a real pleasure and a privilege. Owning a Ferrari for me was lifelong ambition and there were times on the trip when I had to remind myself of that, but more often there were times that I had to pinch myself, I'm driving the Stelvio pass in a Ferrari - my Ferrari, and I'm with my close friends. Life is good.
My previous trips have been in a Caterham, a hired Caterham at that and there is definitely a difference between driving someone else's car where your maximum liability is the excess and potential injury and driving your own pride and joy which represents the rewards of many years of hard work, and a fair proportion of one's wealth.
That said I think it is more about expectations. We were looking for the ultimate in driving roads, just short of a racetrack on the road. We didn't really find this in the Black Forest so we could've skipped that completely and gone straight to Switzerland. That said it was 4 days of travelling for 3 days in the alps. That was too much, and although skipping the Black Forest would've given us more time in Switzerland it is still a lot of travelling.
Due to the weather on the final day in Switzerland as I've written previously, the final day on which we had massive expectations and should've been the best of all was completely spoiled and was actually the worst.
In summary, we spent too long travelling and not enough time driving and some of the roads were busier than expected.
The Car
The question I had before the trip was, would I miss the Caterham. There is seriously something very cool and special about 3 Caterham's rolling into town. The positive reaction you get is fantastic.
I did miss this aspect a little although I have to say that the reaction of the Ferrari was almost exclusively positive. Particularly in France actually, guys on the motorway with thumbs up and urging me to overtake. There was a teenager on a bike in Verdun, riding alongside with his phone taking pictures. He followed us to the hotel and I invited him to sit in the car and I took some pictures of him in it.
The preparation rituals you have to do every morning to get a Caterham ready and every night when you finish up was something I too thought I'd miss, but in practice I was glad I didn't have to faff about like the other two, although I did spend lots of time wishing they'd bloody hurry up!
There were definitely times where the Ferrari felt a little too big, Stelvio was one, due to the cycle race and general traffic and getting in to the odd underground car park, and in this respect being in a Caterham would've been better and more fun.
However, there was a particular drive to the hotel in Vals that I'll never forget and wouldn't want to have been in any other car. Also the vast distances on French motorways were a relative joy in the Ferrari, especially the tolls an especially when the weather turned bad.
What is true though is that our experiences are somewhat different because of the different cars and what they represent to each of us as I mentioned at the start.
As we start to think about next years trip I am slightly concerned that the driving I'm looking for may be slightly different to what my friend's are looking for in their Caterham's. In Caterham speak a "blatt" down some country roads whereas I think i need something a little wider with sweeping bends rather than hairpins.
I also think though that given that we own these cars and drive them all year (rather than just a week in a Caterham every year) that we might have got the "looking for a public racetrack" thing out of our system by the time we go away next year and instead do not judge the trip on the quality of the driving rather than the quality of the journey, destination and adventure.
Finally, if you haven't done something like this in your Ferrari, you really should, it's what they're made for - oh and that sound!
If you got to the bottom of this, thank you for taking the time to read and the comments along the way.
Attachments
Fluffekins
New member
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
sssdu01
Active member
Nice write up and very honest. Its got me thinking about some trips now and buying a Caterham.
I had two seasons of doing hill climbs and sprints in a lotus 7 and I still have the urge to get back into one as its the only car I have ever driven that could be ragged right up to its limits on back lanes and still keep you out of jail. Light weight front engine rear drive set up does let you have some real fun at slower speeds
and buying a Caterham. I had two seasons of doing hill climbs and sprints in a lotus 7 and I still have the urge to get back into one as its the only car I have ever driven that could be ragged right up to its limits on back lanes and still keep you out of jail. Light weight front engine rear drive set up does let you have some real fun at slower speeds
Fluffekins
New member
Nice write up and very honest. Its got me thinking about some trips now
I had two seasons of doing hill climbs and sprints in a lotus 7 and I still have the urge to get back into one as its the only car I have ever driven that could be ragged right up to its limits on back lanes and still keep you out of jail. Light weight front engine rear drive set up does let you have some real fun at slower speeds
You'd be surprised how expensive they are for a good one these days, especially considering how little of it there is. I'd love one too (had one back in 90's) thing is, I know that if I had one now, I'd only use it a couple of times a year and then feel guilty for not using the Ferrari enough.
MalcH
Active member
Excellent info. I've always fancied a Caterham to use on a track. I've almost zero track experience. Anyway back on topic. I bought a cheap Alfa Spider with a view to a European tour almost 6 or 7 years ago and we never did it.
Lots of things have happened and one being a bad experience a few years back where red mist descended and I drove in the pitch black on the left near Garda. I don't recommend that :thumbsdow.
I've also lost confidence in the Alfa as it all started well but is fast becoming unreliable (it is 21) and really needs effort putting in that I can't be bothered to do.
I still have that yearning to go and did think about hiring a LHD car which helps a bit (though I had the accident in a LHD hire car).
All food for thought and you do have me thinking about it again. Probably better in a group perhaps as we were going to do it on our own.
Thanks for sharing as some of those points you make are worth thinking about.:thumbsup:
Lots of things have happened and one being a bad experience a few years back where red mist descended and I drove in the pitch black on the left near Garda. I don't recommend that :thumbsdow.
I've also lost confidence in the Alfa as it all started well but is fast becoming unreliable (it is 21) and really needs effort putting in that I can't be bothered to do.
I still have that yearning to go and did think about hiring a LHD car which helps a bit (though I had the accident in a LHD hire car).
All food for thought and you do have me thinking about it again. Probably better in a group perhaps as we were going to do it on our own.
Thanks for sharing as some of those points you make are worth thinking about.:thumbsup:
Thanks for sharing that App! - I'm all over that for my next road trips!!!
PS - I see you averaged 28 mph...….:sleeping::tongue3::grin: